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--- organize:talkingpoints [2014/01/06 16:34] – [victims of surveillance] nivatius42
+++ organize:talkingpoints [2022/05/08 11:42] (current) – external edit 127.0.0.1
@@ Line 4: / Line 4: @@
 ======= general concerns ======
-The most common arguments against privacy and the use of good crypto are often called the "[[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Horsemen_of_the_Infocalypse|Four Horsemen of the infocaypse]]"
+The most common arguments against privacy and the use of good crypto are often called the "[[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Horsemen_of_the_Infocalypse|Four Horsemen of the infocalypse]]" They are not rational arguments, rather they play on the fears that people have.
-Because the are not rational arguments but playing with the fear of people.
 =====Nothing to hide =====
->**logical fallacies**: good people have nothing to fear, I don't need privacy,only bad people hide things,I don't need to encrypt \\
+**logical fallacies**:
+> good people have nothing to fear
+> I don't need privacy
+> only bad people hide things
+> I don't need to encrypt \\
 ====Argumentations====
@@ Line 52: / Line 55: @@
 **Accusation**: privacy and crypto enable child abuse \\
 **logical fallacy**: surveillance stops child abuse \\
-**truth**: police needs tools like Tor to find people that spread images of child abuse.
+**truth**: abuse of children or other people is a psychological result of the abuser having been disempowered; surveillance and the irrational belief that policing can prevent abuse are further causes of disempowerment; they contribute to turning people into abusers.
 ==== crime in general ====
-Accusation: privacy,  and crypto enable crimes
+**Accusation**: privacy,  and crypto enable crimes
-logical fallacy: surveillance stops crimes and helps to find criminals, if we just had enough surveillance there would be no crime
+**logical fallacies**:
+>surveillance stops crimes and helps to find criminals
+> if we just had enough surveillance there would be no crime
 ====== files,facts and data =====
@@ Line 63: / Line 68: @@
 constitions: of europe, America
-please add links to material like studies that show that data-retention is useless, the cost of surveillance, examples of innocent beeing spyed on ect.
+please add links to material like studies that show that data-retention is useless, the cost of surveillance, examples of innocent beeing spyed on etc.
   * [[http://wiki.vorratsdatenspeicherung.de/%C3%9Cbersetzung/English/Pros_and_cons|arguments against dataretention]]
 ===== victims of surveillance =====
-   *  Scientist Andrej Holm from Germany- "Crime" used the wrong words in his Publications - put in jail for three months and survailed 24/7 for years [[http://www.theguardian.com/education/2007/aug/21/highereducation.uk1|more]]
+   *  Scientist Andrej Holm from Germany- "Crime" used the wrong words in his Publications - put in jail for three months and put under 24/7 surveillance for years [[http://www.theguardian.com/education/2007/aug/21/highereducation.uk1|more]]
-   * James Robinons - "Crime": Wrong Name - big problems traveling [[http://edition.cnn.com/2008/US/08/19/tsa.watch.list/|more]]
+   * James Robinson - "Crime": Wrong Name - big problems traveling [[http://edition.cnn.com/2008/US/08/19/tsa.watch.list/|more]]
-   *Justin Carter - "Crime": bad joke on facebook - but in jail in isolation [[http://www.npr.org/blogs/alltechconsidered/2013/07/03/198129617/teen-jailed-for-facebook-comment-reportedly-beat-up-behind-bars|more]]
+   *Justin Carter - "Crime": bad joke on facebook - put in jail in isolation [[http://www.npr.org/blogs/alltechconsidered/2013/07/03/198129617/teen-jailed-for-facebook-comment-reportedly-beat-up-behind-bars|more]]
    * Leigh Van Bryan - "Crime": Joking - detaimend
    * Johannes Schneiderhäuser - "Crime": owning a guitar - police harassment , kicked out of the USA[[http://www.vice.com/read/i-was-given-a-full-body-search-by-american-border-guards|more]]